Pleasant valley map long dark

The Long Dark. All Discussions ... Also, is that entrance not supposed to show up on the map, when charcoal'd? #2. ajb1978. Sep 13, 2017 @ 10:42am The ledge with the corpse is where you need to go. ... Exit the rear of the dam, follow the river, then through the cave. When you pop out on the ledge in Pleasant Valley, you can poke …

Pleasant valley map long dark. Part 1 of the Pleasant Valley Faithful Cartographer run in The Long Dark. Come check out how many locations I'm able to get crossed off the list in this one!...

Somewhere in Mistery lake and somewhere in Pleasant Valley. In Mistery Lake in the hill in front Camp Office, after the railroad tracks. In Pleasant Valley, in the hill in front/left of rope climb for Signal hill. But remember that bunkers are random in each game, may are there, may not. It is RNG defined whether a bunker will be weapon type …

Coastal Highway (not up-to-date) Updated 2016-04-23 (with rope climbing spots) Complete Map. Explorer Map. Spoiler-free Map. All information gathered, including prepper caches, collectibles, loot, ropes, starter locations and corpses. Includes everything except loot, climbing ropes, collectibles, starter locations and prepper caches. Pensive Pond is a small recreational pond in the hills of Pleasant Valley. Picnickers can enjoy canoeing and, when sunny, sit under the gazebo. A hut with a fishing hole and pot-belly stove sits at the center of the pond. Importantly, the fishing hut also has a door, making it a decent temporary shelter. For players with sufficiently-warm clothing and a bedroll, the hut's relatively easy ... Whiteberry has made some maps for this game that are exceptional. They come in three versions for each area of The Long Dark. Spoiler Free Map - Includes only buildings, bridges, docks, roads, rivers, railways and selected waypoints. Explorer Map - Includes everything except loot, climbing ropes, collectibles, starter locations and prepper caches.Interactive Maps; Recent Blog Posts; The Long Dark. Skills. Archery; Carcass Harvesting; Cooking; Fire Starting ... Desolation Point; Forlorn Muskeg; Forsaken Airfield; Regions (H-Z) Hushed River Valley; Mountain Town; Mystery Lake; Pleasant Valley; Timberwolf Mountain; Transfer Pass; Zone of Contamination; Transition Zones. The Ravine; Old ...Small maple sapling that has been cured. Can be used for crafting and repair.In-game description A Cured Maple Sapling is a plant-based Material that can be used to craft a Survival Bow or Travois at a Work Bench. Both Green and Cured Maple Saplings do not Decay, and will always be at 100% condition. Maple Saplings are found out in forested …These temperature values may chance. • Pleasant Valley has the worst weather , is known with blizzards. • When there is a blizzard, there are no animals around. • In the Interloper mode, the weather can change very quickly. • The temperature is between -18 and -42 with a high probability.Feb 2, 2022 · In this episode we will do a region to region starting at the Farmhouse in Pleasant Valley, and end up at Blackrock. This is the second way to get through th...

The Long Dark v.338 | Steam (Early Access)Time lapse of all possible spawn locations for prepper caches in Pleasant Valley. Every sandbox game will include o...HL really dropped the ball on this one in my opinion. Thinking about giving this game up until story mode, or multiplayer is added. All that hype for notta. #3. JM Feb 8, 2015 @ 8:34am. Well the new map gotta please the people who like outdoor survival. I would not stay there long but i like the diversity.Nosteru Jan 21, 2021 @ 11:00am. Im working on Pleasant Valley charcoal mapping atm. On the guide section you can find some very useful maps to use for explore. You might need rotate this 90 degree to right to fit the ingame charcoal map.The Map is a Survival Menu menu showing a region of Great Bear Island. On the world map, the player can view major geographic markers, as well as regions' relative locations to one another. Each regional map shows more detailed geographic features, as well as informational icons for specific locations and buildings. The map is useful for navigating and displays important features in the areas ...In this episode we will do a region to region starting at the Farmhouse in Pleasant Valley, and end up at Blackrock. This is the second way to get through th...What is a zoning map, how does it work, and why does it matter? This article explains what zoning maps are and how they are used. A zoning map shows the acceptable uses for propert...The Long Dark Topographic Maps. This guide is dedicated to providing high quality topographic and aerial maps for the different regions in The Long Dark. All the images on this guide are thumbnails as uploading the full sized images made it impossible to load the entire page. Simply click the links below each image to get the full resolution ...

Books describing odd or mysterious events in Pleasant Valley. Investigate to find out more about the life and character of people in the Region. Tall Tales is a side mission in Episode 3 of the story, as well as an Achievement of the same name which is earned upon completing the mission. This mission can be started by finding any of the Local Legends …The Pleasant Valley map for The Long Dark is, in principle, easy to find. It marks the most important areas of the terrain, possible danger zones, places where the corpse of a person or animal may lie, as well as the alleged points of appearance of bunkers.The Ravine, also known as The Raven Falls Railway Line or Raven Falls, is a Transition Zone Region connecting Mystery Lake, Coastal Highway, and Bleak Inlet. The Ravine is a long and winding narrow region with sparse Wildlife. No artificial structures are present to shelter in, but three caves provide shelter: one near Mystery Lake, another near the …Go to thelongdark. r/thelongdark. r/thelongdark. The Long Dark is a first-person survival video game developed and published by Hinterland Studio. The player assumes the role of a plane crash survivor who must survive the frigid Canadian wilderness after a global disaster disables all electronics. Welcome to our community!Apple’s iPhone smartphone uses a glass touchscreen as its primary user interface. Almost every activity on the iPhone is conducted through taps, swipes, and pinches. If your iPhone...The Long Dark | All Map Locations Explained. In this guide, you will find a list of Map locations in the game, The Long Dark. To be more specific, this has to do with the Survival Mode of the game. Upon completion of all these maps and their locations, you will unlock the Faithful Cartographer Achievement for the game.

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Not to be confused with Prepper's Abandoned Cache or one of 4 Signal Void bunkers. A Prepper Cache, also known by their nickname of "Bunker", is a reinforced underground shelter with a stockpile of supplies. The contents of caches is randomly selected during world generation across 9 regions in Lower Great Bear. They do not appear in the Far …Interior temp is very warm. The big bed makes it even warmer. All animals spawn and wander within 100m of the house making hunting very easy. Crafting table in basement. All furnature/curtains can be put to good use. Nice central location in map. All cooking can be done in the safety of indoors on the stove.Pleasant Valley's flocks all congregate on Signal Hill, and Forsaken Airfield has a flock right next to the Mindful Cabin overlooking the whole map. Turn the volume way up and listen for croaking sounds and fluttering to pinpoint where the Ptarmigans are, then crouch until you get very close without scaring them.1.9 Hushed River Valley; 1.10 Mountain Town; 1.11 Mystery Lake; 1.12 Pleasant Valley; 1.13 Timberwolf Mountain; 1.14 Transfer Pass; 2 Transition zones. 2.1 Abandoned Mine No. 3; 2.2 Cinder Hills Coal Mine; 2.3 Old Island Connector («Crumbling Highway») 2.4 The Ravine; 2.5 Winding River; 2.6 Various Caves; 2.7 Keeper's Pass North; 2.8 Keeper's ...The Long Dark. All Discussions ... Also, is that entrance not supposed to show up on the map, when charcoal'd? #2. ajb1978. Sep 13, 2017 @ 10:42am The ledge with the corpse is where you need to go. ... Exit the rear of the dam, follow the river, then through the cave. When you pop out on the ledge in Pleasant Valley, you can poke …

Keeper's Pass South is the 4th Transition Zone Region that, along with Keeper's Pass North and a Cave, connects Pleasant Valley to the Blackrock Region. It is a continuation of the road at Long Curve, and contains a scenic stop with a trailer, cars, and some little loot. A crossroads connects to the tunnel leading to Milton, but the tunnel has ... All new bunkers The Long Dark. By Dee. With the release of the DLC the bunker spawning has been changed. There are a total of 9 bunkers in 9 locations, 3 of which will be filled. Locations: Ash Canyon. Bleak Inlet. Forlorn Muskeg. Hushed River Valley.Pleasant Valley; Timberwolf Mountain; ... A detailed map of Timberwolf Mountain. ... The Long Dark Wiki is a FANDOM Games Community.Edits: These are locations that I'm marking as I find them. There's a ruined green barn @ 1936, 46, 1250 right before Heartbreak heading to the Farmhouse. Pensive Pond with ice house @ 2507, 113, 1209. Hunter's Blind @ 2515, 187, 565 with a nearby body. Hilltop Cave @ 2460, 193, 487.Published Feb 6, 2020. by Bill Lavoy. Moose locations can be difficult to find in The Long Dark. There aren’t many in each region, and they don’t always activate on every save. For players that wish to hunt Moose, it helps to have an idea of where you need to go. In this guide, we’ll list each Moose spawn point in The Long Dark.Jun 30, 2015 ... The Long Dark - How to escape Carter River & The Passage to Pleasant Valley (Alpha v.244). 5.1K views · 8 years ago ...more ...Small maple sapling that has been cured. Can be used for crafting and repair.In-game description A Cured Maple Sapling is a plant-based Material that can be used to craft a Survival Bow or Travois at a Work Bench. Both Green and Cured Maple Saplings do not Decay, and will always be at 100% condition. Maple Saplings are found out in forested …Pleasant Valley Farmstead is a house located within Pleasant Valley. It's most easily located by following the main road linking several key areas within Pleasant Valley. The Farmstead is found at the back of a dead orchard, near the side of the river and at the end of a long driveway off the main road (a car and a wooden arch mark the entrance to …Map of Pleasant Valley is a Collectible item found in Episode 3 of the Wintermute story mode. It is given to Astrid Greenwood by Father Thomas showing her how to get to the …Skeeter's Ridge is a location in Pleasant Valley. Skeeter's Ridge lies close to Burned Ridge Cave and west of Draft Dodger's Cabin. There is a potential spawn point for Food type Prepper cache nearby. The most notable features of Skeeter's Ridge are the few ruined buildings in the area. Some frozen corpses may also be found nearby. There is a bulkhead door to the basement next to one of the ...Go to thelongdark. r/thelongdark. r/thelongdark. The Long Dark is a first-person survival video game developed and published by Hinterland Studio. The player assumes the role of a plane crash survivor who must survive the frigid Canadian wilderness after a global disaster disables all electronics. Welcome to our community!

Pleasant Valley is one of the Regions available in the Sandbox mode of The Long Dark. A map can be found here (it may not be 100% accurate). For advanced players. A …

“It is a worship of corporate power to the extent that corporate power becomes the only power in the world.” From the outside, America’s alt right is a nebulous movement based on r...Upper Falls is one of several flowing waterfall in Pleasant Valley. Upper Falls is located on the southeastern side of the region near Thomson's Crossing. Cat Tail plants, Green Birch Sapling and Reishi Mushroom can be found in the area. There is also a cave close by with some supplies. A Frozen Corpse may spawn there sometimes. If visiting the area, be careful, for a bear cave is close by ...Overview. The map is useful for navigating and displays important features in the areas the player has visited. The map does not label the position of the player, so determining where the player is may require comparing the surroundings to the features on the map.The Long Dark v.338 | Steam (Early Access)Time lapse of all possible spawn locations for prepper caches in Pleasant Valley. Every sandbox game will include o...Feb 7, 2015 ... The Long Dark - How to Find/Unlock Pleasant Valley - Quick Tour Guide (v.192 New Update). 32K views · 9 years ago ...more ...These temperature values may chance. • Pleasant Valley has the worst weather , is known with blizzards. • When there is a blizzard, there are no animals around. • In the Interloper mode, the weather can change very quickly. • The temperature is between -18 and -42 with a high probability.The Long Dark Pleasant Valley Region. This Region is large and a map can come in handy while crossing it. This map will come in handy while passing the Pleasant Valley while playing The Long Dark game, it’s huge, and you have to spend some time there. It’s full of all kinds of wildlife and one of the best places to call home. Upper Falls is one of several flowing waterfall in Pleasant Valley. Upper Falls is located on the southeastern side of the region near Thomson's Crossing. Cat Tail plants, Green Birch Sapling and Reishi Mushroom can be found in the area. There is also a cave close by with some supplies. A Frozen Corpse may spawn there sometimes. If visiting the area, be careful, for a bear cave is close by ... The character could still get cabin fever again if the 28 hours that fell off the window (6 days ago) were also mostly outside. In this example, the total is recalculated and is still over 112.98 hours inside for the past 6 days. This is likely if that character spent say the past 3-4 days completely inside in a row.

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Thanksgiving is right around the corner, and if your plans involve traveling, Google has a few tips for how to make that travel a bit more pleasant. As it does every year, the comp...Learn what would happen if the sun disappeared for a week. Advertisement If you happen to live in one of the many areas of the world that are prone to long, cold and dark winters –...Interactive Maps; Recent Blog Posts; The Long Dark. Skills. ... Pleasant Valley; Timberwolf Mountain; ... The Long Dark Wiki is a FANDOM Games Community.Below you'll find a list of locations in The Long Dark's Survival Mode. We hope these might be useful to you in completing the Faithful Cartographer Achievement. ... (and spanning up a little over half of the edge of the map) of the Pleasant Valley map won't mark resources, caves, cars, or a vital location listed on the updated list posted here ... Pleasant Valley Farmstead is a house located within Pleasant Valley. It's most easily located by following the main road linking several key areas within Pleasant Valley. The Farmstead is found at the back of a dead orchard, near the side of the river and at the end of a long driveway off the main road (a car and a wooden arch mark the entrance to down the path, which is lined with telephone ... The Long Dark | All Map Locations Explained. In this guide, you will find a list of Map locations in the game, The Long Dark. To be more specific, this has to do with the Survival Mode of the game. Upon completion of all these maps and their locations, you will unlock the Faithful Cartographer Achievement for the game.Category page. This category is for locations within the Pleasant Valley region. B. Barn (Molly's) Burned Ridge Cave. C. Cascading Falls. Cinder Hills Coal Mine. Community Hall.Here are my top 5 home base locations in the Pleasant Valley region of The Long Dark. Listed as an intermediate region, the dangerous animals and weather of ... ….

The Point of Disagreement is a location/landmark in Pleasant Valley. Containing 3 vehicles, a possibility of finding small food and clothing items, and giving a chance to warm up. A possible spawn for a Frozen corpse is nearby. A fan theory has been created, suggesting that the bodies near the cars might belong to the friends mentioned in the …Find detailed maps of every region in The Long Dark, including Pleasant Valley, a resource rich environment with a great Farmstead to live at. Learn about the weather, wildlife, loot, and challenges of each region in this survival game.Lonely Homestead is a collection of two of cabins in Pleasant Valley. Lonely Homestead lies to the northeast of Pleasant Valley Outbuildings. Player can't enter into the burnt cabins. Howerver, several frozen …Dec 26, 2023 · Find detailed maps of all regions in The Long Dark, including Pleasant Valley, with item locations, caches, loot, ropes and more. Updated for version 2.03 and DLC TFTFT. The Long Dark Pleasant Valley map is like a chilly wonderland waiting to be explored. Imagine a big, snowy area surrounded by tall mountains and frozen lakes. It’s a mix of cosy cabins and open ...Interactive Maps; Recent Blog Posts; The Long Dark. Skills. Archery; Carcass Harvesting; Cooking; Fire Starting ... Desolation Point; Forlorn Muskeg; Forsaken Airfield; Regions (H-Z) Hushed River Valley; Mountain Town; Mystery Lake; Pleasant Valley; Timberwolf Mountain; Transfer Pass; Zone of Contamination; Transition Zones. The Ravine; Old ...Napa Valley is the premier destinations for fine wine, sunshine, and the Californian lifestyle. This ultimate guide will help you explore the region. We may be compensated when you...The world has changed. The only way to survive is to keep moving.In-game description Nomad is one of eight challenges in The Long Dark. Survive for 3 days each in 15 specific locations across the game world.In-game instructionsThe Nomad challenge is one of eight challenges in the Long Dark. It requires the player to spend three entire days in each location listed in their journal. The ...Feb 7, 2015 ... The Long Dark - How to Find/Unlock Pleasant Valley - Quick Tour Guide (v.192 New Update). 32K views · 9 years ago ...more ... Pleasant valley map long dark, Jun 13, 2016 · The Long Dark v.338 | Steam (Early Access)Time lapse of all possible spawn locations for prepper caches in Pleasant Valley. Every sandbox game will include o... , Not to be confused with Prepper's Abandoned Cache or one of 4 Signal Void bunkers. A Prepper Cache, also known by their nickname of "Bunker", is a reinforced underground shelter with a stockpile of supplies. The contents of caches is randomly selected during world generation across 9 regions in Lower Great Bear. They do not appear in the Far Territory Regions. The entrance to a Prepper Cache ... , Created 15 years ago, Google Maps’ Street View has added more than 220 billion Street View images from over 100 countries and territories. Google Maps’ Street View feature was crea..., Go to thelongdark. r/thelongdark. r/thelongdark. The Long Dark is a first-person survival video game developed and published by Hinterland Studio. The player assumes the role of a plane crash survivor who must survive the frigid Canadian wilderness after a global disaster disables all electronics. Welcome to our community!, Interactive Maps; Recent Blog Posts; The Long Dark. Skills. ... Pleasant Valley; Timberwolf Mountain; ... The Long Dark Wiki is a FANDOM Games Community. , Pleasant Valley Farmstead is a house located within Pleasant Valley. It's most easily located by following the main road linking several key areas within Pleasant Valley. The Farmstead is found at the back of a dead orchard, near the side of the river and at the end of a long driveway off the main road (a car and a wooden arch mark the entrance to down the path, which is lined with telephone ... , Please post it in the The Long Dark Forum. How to unlock the Faithful Cartographer achievement in The Long Dark: Map all named locations in Survival Mode. This achievement is worth 90 Gamerscore., Mar 15, 2024 · The sequence of all the region and transition zone maps of The Long Dark will be: The Long Dark Mystery Lake Map. The Long Dark Forlorn Muskeg Map. The Long Dark Mountain Town Map. The Long Dark Hushed River Valley Map. The Long Dark Bleak Inlet Map. The Long Dark Broken Railroad Map. The Long Dark Winding River Map. , Edits: These are locations that I'm marking as I find them. There's a ruined green barn @ 1936, 46, 1250 right before Heartbreak heading to the Farmhouse. Pensive Pond with ice house @ 2507, 113, 1209. Hunter's Blind @ 2515, 187, 565 with a nearby body. Hilltop Cave @ 2460, 193, 487. , A rock cache is a craftable form of storage that appears as a landmark on the player's map. Not to be confused with Memento Rock caches. Rock caches are the only form of craftable storage. Each Rock Cache can …, Three Strikes Farmstead is a collection of several farm buildings in Pleasant Valley, located about 5 minutes walk northwest of the Pleasant Valley Farmstead. Three Strikes Farmstead is a location in Pleasant Valley. It is in the northwest of the region. It is also known as Three Strikes Homestead. The name may refer to three strikes in baseball, which is an out--possibly referencing the ... , The Long Dark is a first-person survival video game developed and published by Hinterland Studio. The player assumes the role of a plane crash survivor who must survive the frigid Canadian wilderness after a global disaster disables all electronics. ... I started up a loper run and was placed in Pleasant Valley. I bee-lined for the farmhouse as ..., In story mode, the cabin is not broken and there is a note "Pleasant valley history, part 2" indoors. I visited there several times in Survival mode, but every time the cabin was ruined. Reply , Below you'll find a list of locations in The Long Dark's Survival Mode. We hope these might be useful to you in completing the Faithful Cartographer Achievement. ... (and spanning up a little over half of the edge of the map) of the Pleasant Valley map won't mark resources, caves, cars, or a vital location listed on the updated list posted here ..., Advanced data. Pleasant Valley Collectible, Part One is a Collectible item found in Episode 3 of the Wintermute story mode as a part of the Forest Talkers side mission. During the course of the mission, the survivor finds the note Pleasant Valley Collectible, Part One from on the wall of the rural store at the crossroads ., [1] Paradise Meadows Farm or The Barker Farm is a location a short distance from Milton in the Mountain Town region. It was home to farmer Martin Barker. The farmstead buildings include a decently sized, very cluttered house; a couple of open carpark/shed structures; as well as an open barn building that has both a workbench and a fire barrel. The farmstead …, Interactive Maps; Recent Blog Posts; The Long Dark. Skills. Archery; Carcass Harvesting; Cooking; Fire Starting ... Desolation Point; Forlorn Muskeg; Forsaken Airfield; Regions (H-Z) Hushed River Valley; Mountain Town; Mystery Lake; Pleasant Valley; Timberwolf Mountain; Transfer Pass; Zone of Contamination; Transition Zones. The Ravine; Old ..., The Long Dark is a first-person survival video game developed and published by Hinterland Studio. The player assumes the role of a plane crash survivor who must survive the frigid Canadian wilderness after a global disaster disables all electronics. ... You could use the mud room of the pleasant valley farmhouse, don’t know how well that ..., Pleasant Valley is one of the Regions available in the Sandbox mode of The Long Dark. A map can be found here (it may not be 100% accurate). For advanced players. A …, Draft Dodger's Cabin is a lonely cabin in Pleasant Valley. Draft Dodger's Cabin is located west of a river and east of Skeeter's Ridge and Burned Ridge Cave. Although there are few supplies inside, some of the furniture can be harvested for cloth and reclaimed wood. Reishi mushrooms and rose hips, as well as rabbits, may be found around the cabin. As the name suggests, the isolated cabin is ... , Mountain Town. Last edited 26 December 2023. Mystery Lake (Region) Last edited 21 days ago. Pleasant Valley. Last edited 24 days ago. Ravine. Last edited 24 days ago. …, Timberwolf Mountain is the 5th Region to be introduced in The Long Dark. It's commonly considered one of the most difficult regions to survive in due to frigid temperatures (sub -20C / -4F almost every day) and frequent blizzards (usually at least three per week). These conditions limit the time a player can safely travel outside with anything less than top …, The Long Dark Pleasant Valley Easy Mode Map Olague Wimplende, Map of pleasant valley is a collectible item found in episode 3 of the wintermute story mode. It’s a huge area, full of all kinds of. Source: steamsplay.com. The Long Dark New generation of maps Steams Play, Last edited 24 june 2023. I rotated the map of pleasant valley 90 …, Nomad is one of the Challenges present in The Long Dark. In Nomad, the player always starts at Pleasant Valley Farmstead. The objective is to spend three days in each of the fifteen locations provided. The player is given all fifteen locations at the start of the game. It is not necessary to go to the locations in a specific order. Mystery Lake Camp Office …, A physical map shows the location of landforms and features like rivers, lakes, ocean, mountains, valleys, deserts and different land elevations. When making a physical map, differ..., A physical map shows the location of landforms and features like rivers, lakes, ocean, mountains, valleys, deserts and different land elevations. When making a physical map, differ..., Below you'll find a list of locations in The Long Dark's Survival Mode. We hope these might be useful to you in completing the Faithful Cartographer Achievement. ... (and spanning up a little over half of the edge of the map) of the Pleasant Valley map won't mark resources, caves, cars, or a vital location listed on the updated list posted here ..., May 1, 2016 · Detailed Region Maps - The Long Dark. Von Whiteberry. Please note that these maps are no longer up to date and will not be updated. It has been fun to work and updating them during Early Access, and I will leave them up here for anyone who still find them useful. I hope you will still find your way in The Long Dark and thank you for your ... , Google Maps is going to introduce a new "Immersive View for Routes" feature in select cities, Google announced at its annual I/O conference. Google Maps is going to introduce a new..., Signal Hill is a location found in Pleasant Valley and provides a fenced-in (single access point) area, on top of a hill. The view over the farming areas is advantageous, weather permitting. A distinguishing feature is the radio tower itself, which can be seen from very far away. Signal Hill can be accessed by trail either from the east or the west up the southern mountain. A general variety ..., 1.9 Hushed River Valley; 1.10 Mountain Town; 1.11 Mystery Lake; 1.12 Pleasant Valley; 1.13 Timberwolf Mountain; 1.14 Transfer Pass; 2 Transition zones. 2.1 Abandoned Mine No. 3; 2.2 Cinder Hills Coal Mine; 2.3 Old Island Connector («Crumbling Highway») 2.4 The Ravine; 2.5 Winding River; 2.6 Various Caves; 2.7 Keeper's Pass North; 2.8 Keeper's ..., Repaired all the transmitters. Checked off. Found my first SV bunker in Bleak Inlet, now waiting for days in Pleasant Valley for an aurora to find the second one, finally it hits, but now: NO SIGNAL on the receiver. Nothing. Tried getting close to the approximate area, but the receiver shows no reaction. Nothing. EDIT: use a youtube video to find the …, The Long Dark is a first-person survival video game developed and published by Hinterland Studio. The player assumes the role of a plane crash survivor who must survive the frigid Canadian wilderness after a global disaster disables all electronics. ... Pleasant valley is a weird map when it comes to navigations. In my experience you have to ...